srini_sadhu: Om Sang Saraswatyai Namaha!
srini_sadhu: Sutra 5 is about Dharma
srini_sadhu: It raises some interesting questions
srini_sadhu: Actually very important questions
srini_sadhu: First the Sutra
srini_sadhu: Srstidharmena jivayatra
srini_sadhu: Srsti is creation
srini_sadhu: Dharmena is “by means of Dharma”
srini_sadhu: Jiva means the individual soul
srini_sadhu: Yatra is pilgrimage or journey
srini_sadhu: There are two interpretations of this Sutra
srini_sadhu: First one says
srini_sadhu: This creation is a collection of individual souls who are making their personal pilgrimages by means of Dharma
srini_sadhu: Second says
srini_sadhu: Dharma comes about in creation when every individual strives in its pilgrimage towards perfection.
srini_sadhu: First, what do we mean by Dharma?
forall10q: ideal of perfection
srini_sadhu: Jai Maa!
Debi GLSDM: Dharma? What our purpose is in being here. To fulfill karma
srini_sadhu: Till I met Maa and Swamiji, I took it to mean Morally Righteous Conduct
vish108weshwar: right action in accord with all laws of nature?
srini_sadhu: This word has so many meanings
Debi GLSDM: so right action is to follow our dharma
srini_sadhu: It could also mean Harmony in the Universe
srini_sadhu: So how do we find out about our Dharma?
Janitri Rybacki: wouldn't it be exactly where each one of us is in our life right now?....our dharma is our "job"/duty to God.
Debi GLSDM: By following what we are driven to do intuitively from childhood perhaps
srini_sadhu: Dear janitri, how do we know we are in the right place
Janitri Rybacki: oh...well, acceptance and surrender to where we are...and a knowingness when the place also isn't right. Maa is like the Mother Cat that picks us up in her mouth and takes us from place to place, where we need to be.
srini_sadhu: Would you think of Dharma of a vision of our future?
srini_sadhu: as a vision of our future?
Janitri Rybacki: yes
Debi GLSDM: Yea
vish108weshwar: i do not understand
srini_sadhu: Dear Vish, I am thinking of it as what is the right thing I should be doing now and in the future? How should I be using my mind, hands, and legs to serve the world
vish108weshwar: do you mean the "ideal of perfection" that we carry in our hearts? the goal we strive for?
vish108weshwar: i see and i agree
srini_sadhu: Yes that too
srini_sadhu: When I ask myself this question, I feel a mental block. How can I transcend this?
Debi GLSDM: What have you always wanted to do? What do you dream about being. & then turn it into service
vish108weshwar: so our previous sutras on discrimination play a big part in this striving
srini_sadhu: How so Vish?
Janitri Rybacki: i like the idea of turning it into service.
vish108weshwar: if i have a goal, i have to work towards it. if another goal pops up, i have to analyze it so see if it takes me towards or away from my main goal
vish108weshwar: the idea of turning into service is the best. instead of making it a task or hassle
vish108weshwar: although sometimes, no matter how i state it, the moment requires tremendous effort to succeed
srini_sadhu: One interpretation of this Sutra is that everyone should find their Dharma and strive for this ideal
srini_sadhu: Namaste Usha!
srini_sadhu: We are discussing Dharma
Debi GLSDM: If it is something you love and are so good at that you study it or do it with devotion then it is not work you want to do it.
srini_sadhu: The other interpretation is everybody is doing their Dharma and we should accept that
srini_sadhu: That's nice Debi
vish108weshwar: how do i accept if someone is making a problem for me?
Janitri Rybacki: Vish, i often look at it as their role to play and also my karma to be a witness to the role that the other is playing. it's not always so easy though....
srini_sadhu: Witness Bhava!
vish108weshwar: so being a witness is the answer? Not taking it personally?
Janitri Rybacki: the witness doesn't have the ego taking it personally. The ego wants to take it personally.
srini_sadhu: How do we cultivate the attitude of witness?
vish108weshwar: according to the story in the sutra, The King's Cut Finger, everything has a purpose and one should not be attached? Who agrees?
Debi GLSDM: me
Janitri Rybacki: haven't read the story of the King's Cut Finger
vish108weshwar: janitri-i agree with you. how to cultivate this attitude because it is not a mood we can make?
srini_sadhu: Being unattached seems a bit cold to me
srini_sadhu: I prefer to think of it as being cheerful and calm under all circumstances
vish108weshwar: if it is a mood, it would be cold. i agree
vish108weshwar: how do we attain that state?
Debi GLSDM: By realizing that everything has a purpose
srini_sadhu: I think it will helpful to study the lives of all those who attained that state
vish108weshwar: yes, but that is still a mood, or so i feel
Debi GLSDM: Good idea Srini
vish108weshwar: study helps the intellect, but if someone is angry, my mood of cheerfulness goes quickly
Sarada Devi: perfect love and compassion can only be unattached because it is in the state of oneness - what is there to be attached to ?oneness
srini_sadhu: If I can keep the image of my beloved in front of me all the time, thinks work out more smoothly
vish108weshwar: so it is a state of being, not a mood we make
Debi GLSDM: So are you saying see the beloved in them
Janitri Rybacki: to me, when someone is angry at me, it often is that they need energy from me, or a response from me regarding their anger. if the response from me is negative to their negativity, the cycle continues. if it is cheerful and positive, Maa is there.
Janitri Rybacki: Srini, do you picture the image of your beloved in your mind's eye?
vish108weshwar: Maa says: do sadhana, pray, do homa, puja, get into a relationship with the Divine, be more aware of the Divine, as a result of your spiritual practices, than you are of the ego. Make friends with Divinity in your heart and mind.
srini_sadhu: Everywhere and everyone, Debi, as much as possible. I tried it once, but find it hard to sustain
srini_sadhu: Yes Janitri
srini_sadhu: That's nice Vish
Debi GLSDM: Yes it sound good but doing can be difficult
vish108weshwar: yes janitri
Janitri Rybacki: thank U
Debi GLSDM: Maybe that is where our practicing comes in for us with all this we keep trying to do it correctly What ever that is at that time
Debi GLSDM: Don't give up (striving)
vish108weshwar: In the Gita, Lord Krishna says: Be established in Being, then perform action. Then you will not be attached to the fruits of action. Remember the earlier sutras about the arrows?
Debi GLSDM: Yes
Debi GLSDM: good
srini_sadhu: So things to think about, (a) What is our Dharma? and (b) How can we be non--judgmental of our friends and co-workers
srini_sadhu: Is there some other things that we can discuss under Dharma?
Sarada Devi: duty
vish108weshwar: question from page 44, when we become one with God, all join in the realization of divinity. what does that mean?
srini_sadhu: Good one, Usha!
srini_sadhu: Vish, page # does not sound right
Sarada Devi: no more separation
vish108weshwar: it is the bottom of page 44 in my book. i think i have the older book oops
vish108weshwar: the quote is taken right before the story about the king begins
srini_sadhu: One Swamiji said that if one being realized God, seven generations before and after get blessed.
vish108weshwar: the quote reads: Ultimately, when we become one with God, we become one with all dharma. All join in the realization of our Divinity.
Debi GLSDM: yes
vish108weshwar: maybe it also means that all creation, since it is one, is blessed when one soul becomes realized with
srini_sadhu: Dear usha, we were discussing Dharma, dharma being our purpose in life. WE could also think of it as all our duties.
Debi GLSDM: Like caring for family, work etc
srini_sadhu: Personal, Family, and Professional
Debi GLSDM: Like Usha said Duty?
Sarada Devi: and universal
srini_sadhu: Yes, Debi
srini_sadhu: Vish, related to what you were saying, some one told me when we receive something from a realized soul, it as if the entire creation is coming together to give you that thing.
Sarada Devi: everything is linked to everything else
vish108weshwar: that is great. i feel that when Maa blesses me
srini_sadhu: Could we discuss Sutra # 6
srini_sadhu: ??
vish108weshwar: yes
Janitri Rybacki: yes
Debi GLSDM: ok
srini_sadhu: Karen?
forall10q: y
Sarada Devi: please
srini_sadhu: This Sutra is about Intuitive Cognition and Samadhi
srini_sadhu: I will just write the English
srini_sadhu: It says" The Highest attainment of a soul is "intuitive illumination".
Sarada Devi: Turiya
srini_sadhu: Kashyapa Muni gives us a concrete goal to strive for.
srini_sadhu: There are three modes of perception
srini_sadhu: Pratyaksha means perceiving through the senses
srini_sadhu: Example, we smell a flower
srini_sadhu: Pratyaya means conceiving in the mind
srini_sadhu: Example, we close our eyes and visualize the flower
srini_sadhu: Prakasha, means going beyond the mind and have an intuitive experience
srini_sadhu: We probably can't describe this experience, but we can discuss the path to get to it?
srini_sadhu: How do we know that we are using intuition?
vish108weshwar: does this mean that the whole reason we are on earth, in a body, is to have this experience? this is our dharma?
srini_sadhu: Good question Vish. What do you all think?
vish108weshwar: dharma = highest goal of existence
vish108weshwar: dharma=highest ideal of perfection
Janitri Rybacki: it's our duty to be here on this Earth...sweet and relieving to see life this way.
vish108weshwar: jan-yes
srini_sadhu: Thank you Janitri!
Sarada Devi: there is a "taste” a particular "felt sense" that can only be experienced
vish108weshwar: how do others fell about this?
Sarada Devi: sorry i mean felt
srini_sadhu: When you look at the life of every saint, there is a period in their lives where they drop everything and go into solitude to attain to this state
Sarada Devi: one intuits the beingness of something - a sense of wholeness
Debi GLSDM: Can you say what Samadhi means?
vish108weshwar: we have gravitated and been pulled to Maa for this very reason
srini_sadhu: It is perfect union with Your beloved
Debi GLSDM: yes
Debi GLSDM: thanks
srini_sadhu: I and You become one
vish108weshwar: ah, that is what i want.
srini_sadhu: I was asking Swamiji a question about samadhi a few months ago
Sarada Devi: need to die to be reborn
srini_sadhu: He talks about type of Samadhi called Salokya
srini_sadhu: You and your beloved are in the same physical or metaphysical loka or plane
srini_sadhu: I said, Swamiji, you and I are in the same room, are we not in salokya samadhi
Debi GLSDM: I remember reading about dif kinds
Janitri Rybacki: Srini, what was Swamiji's response?
srini_sadhu: He said we are the same room, but my mind is seeing other objects and my mind is wandering
Debi GLSDM: yes thank you
srini_sadhu: So in samadhi there is an intensity of absorption where the only thing that exists is you, your beloved and the feeling of love
Debi GLSDM: ok
srini_sadhu: Later, he added, when you come out of samadhi, you see the world differently, with illumination
Debi GLSDM: There is a lot to digest in this Sutra
Debi GLSDM: very good
srini_sadhu: What can we do everyday to make progress to this intuitive state?
Sarada Devi: meditate
srini_sadhu: Thank you Usha!
vish108weshwar: how would performing seva help us reach that state?
Sarada Devi: if we eat something for instance - try to remember its nature for instance the apple - tree- earth water etc.
vish108weshwar: usha-good, how would seva help us?
Sarada Devi: develop a felt sense for the beingness of everything we encounter
vish108weshwar: when we perform seva, how should we feel? What should be our focus?
Sarada Devi: seva fosters a sense of love - connection - wholeness
Debi GLSDM: realizing we are all part of each other so to serve them is to serve God
vish108weshwar: debi-good,
vish108weshwar: usha-good
srini_sadhu: If we put a feeling of love into our seva, then we sit for meditation that feeling may linger
Debi GLSDM: mmm ok
Janitri Rybacki: living love!
vish108weshwar: if my mind is active during seva, the ego is still engaged. how to settled the mind during seva so the ego loses hold?
Sarada Devi: or vice versa
srini_sadhu: If throughout the day are mind is jumping around, when we sit for meditation our mind will jump around, poor thing
Sarada Devi: MANTRA
srini_sadhu: From time to time check, am I in the heart when I am doing my work
vish108weshwar: poor thing, i want it to stop so i can have union with Maa. But there must be some process to use during seva, since that is where we spend most of our time-in activity?
Debi GLSDM: Where did i read about meditation? Meditate in confusion get confusion
Sarada Devi: always practice sensation - i.e. feet on the ground
Janitri Rybacki: Srini, question: feeling this in the heart?
vish108weshwar: i have same question
Debi GLSDM: Meditate in love brings love
BharatiMa: No, thank you.
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: BharatiMa has declined to join.
srini_sadhu: Feelings are deep, enduring; thought are shallow and transient
Sarada Devi: feeling is in heart sensation can be anywhere
srini_sadhu: If my mind is racing or stressed I know I am not in my heart
Janitri Rybacki: thank U
vish108weshwar: even deeper srini, is pure consciousness, bliss, absorption. Once we experience that, then when we perform seva, automatically we are in our hearts, the ego is less attached, and God is more in control
srini_sadhu: This is a good question to ask people on the club and Swamiji
srini_sadhu: How to feel love when we do our work?
Debi GLSDM: Good
srini_sadhu: Like Usha said, Mantra is a good thing to keep us balanced
vish108weshwar: so, for this week, can we "watch" our activity and note the times we are in "love" during activity, and how we got there? And how we can maintain that?
Debi GLSDM: Would it help to do our work as we are doing it for God
vish108weshwar: debi-yes
srini_sadhu: Also when we close our eyes for meditation we can se how the feelings during the day carried over into our meditation
vish108weshwar: srini-yes
Debi GLSDM: ok
srini_sadhu: I am happy I was chatting with you all for one hour
vish108weshwar: seems like only a moment
srini_sadhu: I pray for our continued friendship and pure love
vish108weshwar: that means to me it was very joyful and in bhava samadhi
Sarada Devi: sorry we were late took a while to adjust
srini_sadhu: I also pray that we all achieve our Dharma whatever it may be!!
vish108weshwar: thanks for your love and care for us all
Janitri Rybacki: thank you dear friends in Maa...
srini_sadhu: No problem Usha!
Debi GLSDM: Thank you discussion
vish108weshwar: janitri
srini_sadhu: Please share your thoughts on Dharma, Samadhi, Working with love on the club!!
vish108weshwar: all of you, thanks for coming. it is too short
forall10q: Good night everyone. Thank you!
vish108weshwar: jai maa, jai swami
Janitri Rybacki: God Night!
vish108weshwar: janitri i like that god night
Janitri Rybacki: thanks...got it from a friend!
vish108weshwar: can i borrow it?
srini_sadhu: There are no coincidences only God-incidences
Janitri Rybacki: this friend did it at the end of a chat also...YES!
vish108weshwar: thanks, like your too srini
Janitri Rybacki: God-incidences! Oh, pure-fect!
vish108weshwar: so wonderful
Sarada Devi: Namah Shivaya!